ladyjanelly: (Default)
ladyjanelly ([personal profile] ladyjanelly) wrote2008-01-04 04:45 pm

Celebrating Survival

Anti-Privilege meme.

Yeah, I'm a little bitter.  Doing that meme made me realize how much it takes some people to feel they're in the privileged category.  

The meme is yes, a measure of privilege.

So here's the other side of the coin.  

I only had myself to base this thing on, and the few things I've heard from other people that I can think of at the moment.

Feel free to steal it and add to it.  Celebrate the strength it takes to survive.

(Bold if it's true)

 

 

I knew nobody but me would pay for my college

I’ve known the joy of a welfare Christmas

Someone besides my parents were the main providers of most non-necessary items

I thought Santa Claus hated me (or I was real bad), based on the gifts you got

I didn’t have the normal climate control for where I lived (A/C in the south, Heat in the north)

I didn’t have cable TV

I saw at least one of my parents use drugs

I saw at least one of my parents buy or sell drugs

My parents used food stamps to put food on the table

I remember living for more than a week without a necessary utility (gas, water, power)

My family was evicted or foreclosed on

My home suffered from a vermin infestation

I ate Lunch at school because it was free

I ate breakfast in the school lunch room, because it was free

 I was the oldest, and all my clothing was kept for younger siblings
I was not the oldest, and all my clothing was used

 

EDIT:

I knew nobody but me COULD pay for my college
I'm the first woman in 3 generations to not be pregnant by age 18.

[identity profile] davidcrackin.livejournal.com 2008-01-04 11:54 pm (UTC)(link)
My roommate and I fight about this all the time; how a person's socialization affects their 'success' in life. I put 'success' in parenthesis because we have repeatedly had to re-define it, as well as about a hundred other terms. Frick. It frustrates me how little consideration priviledge is given as a predicting factor of a person's future potential. A person should never underestimate the impact a safety net has on their life. I will *never* become homeless; I will *never* suffer an undiagnosed mental or physical illness; I will *never* go without the basic human needs (food/shelter/clothing); I will *never* have to do something illegal to survive. I never have, and I never will because of my friends and my family.

I think my definition of priviledge is being given enough to acheive damn near anything you want to without having to factor in the cost of failing. If that even makes sense.

I don't even know ... but I think I am going to go call my mom & dad.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:13 am (UTC)(link)
I can't imagine who I'd be without my grandparents. Seriously. I always had them to catch me when my mom and whatever man she was dating/married to at the time couldn't. They paid for summer camp and operations and clothes for school.

The best thing that ever happened to me was moving in with my grandparents. The best thing that ever happened to my sisters was when my mom and them moved next to my grandparents.

I agree with the priviledge thing. Now that I'm in a fairly successful situation (My husband has a good job, we own our house (thanks to a perfect-timing sale of my old house in florida that I only was buying because it was cheeper to pay a farm home loan than pay rent) I have time and money to go to school), it's scary. I have this recurring terror that I'm gonna finish my 2 yr degree and it won't get me a good job and I'll have wasted all this money and time. My husband, who came up a little better than me is like "so what? You'll go back and get something else if you want to." and even his trust in me is terrifying.

I need to go call my grandparents.

[identity profile] beluga.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:01 am (UTC)(link)
Funnily enough, though I come from the middle class, I can still say I:
-knew nobody but me would pay for my college
- didn’t have cable TV
- was the oldest, and all my clothing was kept for younger siblings..

I can add a few other things;
- Had cheese & bread for 3 meals a day..
- Never ate at a restaurant
- Never owned any brand clothes (Gap, Levis etc.)

I've never really lacked anything. My parents have owned their own home since before I was born..it's in one of the best streets in the area I live in. *But* they both were without jobs in the late 80s due to a crack in the economics..(Think it happened all over the world)

But thanks to foresight on my fathers part (money saved) + a situation where his work gave him an option of 1yr paid leave *or* for him to be supported thru college (He had a master in Computers beforehand, which sadly meant he wouldn't find any work) he was able to study for a bachelor and in the early 90s, and get a job as an accountant.

While he studied, my mom looked after us kids + watched other people's kids, thus getting a little money.. Then, when my father got a steady job, my mom finally got a job (I was 13) and decided she wanted to finish high school. She did so while working full time for the local phone company (she started studying the moment she got the job, scared that she might loose her job due to lack of education if we went thru another bad time (those with higher education are often safer in bad times + get better paid..)

Anyways, my dad is now the boss of the accountant firm. My mom is one of four who kept their jobs when the phone company decided to try something new..

They now belong in the upper middle class. But you wouldn't know it just to look at them. Fair enough, they spend more than they once did, but never have they forgotten the hard times.

And neither have I..I worry about money and it drives my BF nuts. His parents hid their financial worries from him too well:-(

Anyways, my childhood cannot be compared to yours. You had it *way* worse! But y'know, behind a "perfect" home, there can still be people wondering how the bills are gonna be paid...

xx

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:26 am (UTC)(link)
my childhood cannot be compared to yours.

I think everyone's childhood pain and fear and distress is their own. Equally valid. I wasn't going for a "more trauma than thou" thing here, just making sure that people realize that not having an IRA in high school doesn't make them under-privileged.

Those hungry-times leave a mark. Pack-rat behavior and the like. For a while, my ex and I were kind of couch-surfing/homeless, and I kept everything that was important in my purse. I can't carry one anymore, because I put everything I don't want to have taken away in it and it ends up being way too heavy.

With my husband and my relative success, I really don't know how to cope with money. I sort of spend it down until it's the small amounts that I know what to do with. We don't do much credit card debt, but if there's money in the bank for much more than the bills it's foreign territory.

[identity profile] hrh-anm.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:12 am (UTC)(link)
After looking over your "Anti-Privilege Meme" I bet you could make one hell of a "Succeeded In Life...." meme. I wish I could say something more significant concerning your childhood situation Janell but I would feel a bit like a hypocrite.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:20 am (UTC)(link)
The sad thing is, most of my "Succeeded in life" stuff comes from not having kids. If I had, I honestly can't say I'd have done much better than my mom. I'd have avoided the husband on drugs thing, which having the land to grow said drugs (for use and sale)on seems to me the reason for the crappy-ass trailers which resulted in the bug infestation.

Hypocrite why?

[identity profile] hrh-anm.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 01:15 am (UTC)(link)
"If I had, I honestly can't say I'd have done much better than my mom" Are you sure Janell? I don't think our financial status has anything to do with how we raise our kids. I have always admired your inner strength, and I mean that with all my heart. I think you would have done everything morally possible to raise your children to be good and I think you would have instilled in them the same values you carry with you every day. I know some very wealthy people who are really shitty parents.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 01:27 am (UTC)(link)
I think we do alright by our foundlings, but I dunno about full-time parenting from baby-hood.

I'm not saying my mom raised us bad. I mean, I am who I am and she had some influence on that, both the good and not-so-good.

Maybe she did do everything she was capable of. I can't rewind and look at what she dealt with every day.

[identity profile] hrh-anm.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 01:36 am (UTC)(link)
Yep. :)

[identity profile] elmathelas.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:28 am (UTC)(link)
I didn't do the privledge meme, because in part it was never meant to be a meme on livejournal, it was meant to show college freshmen that most of them, despite what they've told themselves, have not been hard done by.

And I also didn't do it because imho it's meant to be humbling for the majority of people who take it, not to be like awww, yeah, look what I lived without.

It's also irritating, because no one who feels like they worked for what they have wants to have it thrown in their face that they've had their very foundations handed to them, even if in my case I did have my foundations laid for me by my parents. I'll admit that I'm only human and I like being petted on the head and told I've done good and worked hard in my life, something I hear most often from the parents who paved my road for me. But-- if my parents had done the privlidge meme, not one single thing would be bolded on either of theirs. Then again, very little from your version of the meme would be bolded either.

I'm enormously privlidged-- and to say that a lot of people would think that I grew up wealthy as wealthy is defined by television. To me wealth was defined by always having enough food, even if it wasn't the food we might have liked to have had at that moment (and not having what we wanted was rare-- I remember during one lean-ish time my mom asking my sister and I if we'd mind having something else for dinner other than chicken, so that the chicken we had left could be saved for my dad, and she looked so ashamed to have to ask. We were jazzed about getting to have toast and peanut butter for dinner because mmmm, toast, but I know I'm privlidged because it was odd enough that I do remember it happening and I remember the other times when my mom would have "already eaten" when serving dinner-- the fact that I remember means it was odd.) And always a place to live, a new jacket ever winter, boots that fit, heat that was on one way or another and knowing that if something horrible happened to my parents and they weren't there to take care of us there were always aunts and uncles and friends.

And, as with anything, even your meme is imprecise, even if it does, imho, hit the nail on the head a lot better. I saw my dad do drugs (pot, when he was practicing with his band) and all my clothes were saved for my sister, and we didn't have cable (there was no cable where we lived) but that was more to do with my parents being reformed hippies than any kind of hardship. And I surely have lived without power and running water for a week or three at a time, but when you chose to live in the woods you chose to be the last one on the power company's list for getting stuff turned back on after a blizzard or hurricaine. Woodstoves for the win.

Still, if I filled it out without commentary, the snapshot from that would be a far cry from the life I know I've lived. I don't like the privlidge meme on livejournal, because I think it's strayed from it's original intent, and what are people trying to prove by posting it?

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:44 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah, the privilege meme was really either a "You didn't work for what you are now" list or a "Look what you missed out on" list. Neither one feels good at all. Does a few things my grandparents paid for make up for the crap I lived with on a daily basis until I moved out of my house and in with the grandparents?

The funny thing is, I remember little lack of food in my childhood. Foodstamps go far when you're buying raw ingredients, no convenience food at all, and growing a huge garden all the time. It used to piss me off that whoever mom was married to or dating at the time got the lion's share of the best parts, but we always got some meat or whatever (when she wasn't with a vegetarian).

Heh. I didn't even think of power or water being off for utility-company reasons. I was thinking lack-of-payment reasons.

I posted the priviledge meme too, but it felt funny to do, and yeah, I have no idea what I was trying to prove. My commentary mostly points out that that thing isn't very accurate.

[identity profile] hrh-anm.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 01:03 am (UTC)(link)
I think both memes are ok Janell...I think they are meant to get the reader thinking about themselves and their own situation. Though I was reading someone else's answers (yours), it really made me think about my own life as compared to yours. I like the memes and I think in most social settings it could/will stimulate interesting conversation.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 01:30 am (UTC)(link)
I think they work as food for thought, but the answers are so subjective. Like dreadful_birds says, what does all that privilege mean if your parents don't care if you live or die? What does any level of deprivation mean if you're really loved and cared for?

[identity profile] elmathelas.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 01:38 am (UTC)(link)
The worst kind of poverty that I have to deal with as a nurse is people who can't get food stamps because they make too much money but don't have enough money to keep the heat on and buy food too.

I knew what the intent was on your meme-- which is a good one, by the way-- but the thing is that people can manipulate the answers without technically lying, if they've got a mind to.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, memes are supposed to be innocent fun, for the most part, and the privlidge meme leaving the classroom and heading for the internets didn't seem like such a hot idea.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 03:15 am (UTC)(link)
We never had to make that choice, partly because my mom planted a 50'X100' garden 3 times a year, and because we were in florida, and a year's worth of gas was like $150. We never had A/C at home until right before I moved out at 16.

The pot farm hidden in a secret room in the chicken coop helped ends meet a lot too. I remember when I was about 11. My real dad came to the house and bought drugs from my step-dad and barely nodded to me.

Memes are supposed to be innocent fun, and I think I didn't realize this one wasn't for me until I was already riled up.

[identity profile] dreadful-birds.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 12:59 am (UTC)(link)
Is the original meme supposed to have something to do with social success?

Because at that point I think the defining privilege is whether or not your parents cared whether you lived or died.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 02:35 am (UTC)(link)
I think it's supposed to. Financial/educational too, maybe?

I was always sure my mom wanted me to be alive. She chose to have me move out rather than the boyfriend who was molesting me in my sleep and looking in the bathroom window while I showered though.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 02:35 am (UTC)(link)
Sorry, I'm all bitter and stuff tonight :)

[identity profile] dreadful-birds.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 02:38 am (UTC)(link)
I think you're allowed after all that! And I hate those stupid memes too.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 02:58 am (UTC)(link)
Counseling stirred up all this old crap, and when I tell my mom I'm having depression or in therapy or whatever, she wants me to tell her it isnt her fault. Sometimes I feel "Oh, whatever, it's not all about you, woman" and sometimes I feel like "yeah, you were an accomplice. good luck with that guilt."

[identity profile] dreadful-birds.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 02:32 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah, sometimes when I was in intense therapy I felt like I was kicking an ant bed. If you know what I mean.

[identity profile] avid-slacker.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 02:56 am (UTC)(link)
I find it interesting because almost nothing on the privilege meme applies to me and almost nothing on this meme applies to me, save for the fact that I paid for college with grants and was the first to go.

I do know that we definitely weren't middle-class, but I think like most people we lived in that space where money is always an issue but most of life's smaller luxuries can still be afforded.

I remember Cindy Crawford once said that the best part of being a supermodel was not having a broken vehicle be the difference between surviving and not. That's what I aspire towards, not fearing the lack of money.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 03:09 am (UTC)(link)
the broken vehicle thing. Exactly.

It's a good goal.

I think the parents' money-savy has a lot to do with the feeling of poverty. To some point, my mom chose the poverty as part of a semi-hippie lifestyle. Some stuff just wasn't necessary to be like that.

Again, I dunno if I could have done everything better in her shoes.
epeeblade: (Default)

[personal profile] epeeblade 2008-01-05 03:16 am (UTC)(link)
You really got me all thinky about this. I may have grown up in the inner city, and yeah, my family didn't always have everything, but I had two really dedicated parents and that's meant everything.

[identity profile] ladyjanelly.livejournal.com 2008-01-08 12:24 am (UTC)(link)
That's pretty cool. I think--maybe if I'd had that, then this other stuff wouldn't be as big of a deal, y'know?
ext_29986: (Default)

[identity profile] fannishliss.livejournal.com 2008-01-05 06:05 pm (UTC)(link)
I filled out the Privilege meme, not to gripe about any privileges I didn't have, but because I am really grateful for the gifts of my childhood. I copied it from Cormallen, who was also saying how it applied so differently since she was born in the Soviet Union. I still find it really interesting to see what responses it provokes in people, and I'm interested to learn where people came from and the path to who they are today.

[identity profile] trexr1.livejournal.com 2008-01-07 06:39 pm (UTC)(link)
It's an interesting meme, however I hate lists like this. It makes me feel all categorical and cruddy. It inevitably leaves out the differences between luxury items and a safe, loving environment.

And I really dislike the fact that it tries to make you feel like crap either way. It's a no-win situation. The hardest thing a person's been through is still the hardest thing they've been through. Just because it doesn't compare to someone else's pain of suffering doesn't make it less real to that person.

Daniel peed in a bucket until he was like 11 or something and considers himself priveledged that he grew up in the country and had two loving parents who didn't beat the crap out of him. I grew up in the lap of luxury (upper middle class) and my parents made mine and my siblings life a living hell for the majority of our childhoods. Yes, we had money, new stuff, every material thing a kid could ask for including the proverbial trust fund, but it all means shit, when you're holding your baby brother and hiding under the bed when your parents are screaming at one another trying to keep him from crying and drawing attention to you. I don't feel priveledged to have lived in that environment. Luxury doesn't equal priveldge.

rrrrg. Sorry for the rant. These things get my dander up as well.