Selling clothing to plus-size women

[ladyjanelly]

I've got a few non-custom-order 2XL sweater-hoodie projects in my work-stream and I'm wondering how to handle a couple of issues and I'm hoping to get some feedback from anyone who wants to give it, but especially you ladies who are around that size.  I apologize in advance for anything I get wrong and hope I don't offend anyone.  

Using upcycled materials for plus sizes is a little different than using stock fabric, in that it requires quite a bit more labor to go along with the larger amount of sweaters.  There is more piecing required to make it large enough and to keep it from having too much non-altered space.  Also, "found" zippers only come 22", maybe 24" and are too short for the plus sizes so I need to buy new decorative hooks that are almost the same cost as the sweaters themselves.  

So to be fair to myself, the finished 2XL product needs to be around 1.5 times the price of a medium.  But I feel bad charging more, I feel guilty that i don't have any of that size up yet, and I feel it's being condescending to explain why it's more in my product notes even though I know I probably should so it doesn't look like I'm taking advantage of the larger size ladies.  

Does that makes sense at all?  I don't even know for sure what my question is, I just would like your thoughts and maybe that'll give me a starting place to tease through my own emotions on this issue and figure out what I'm even asking.

Thanks for any feedback,
-J

Comments

[violetknights.livejournal.com]

I think everything you say is fair enough - if the cost of the fastenings is a large part of the issue it might be worth making the larger size ones so they can be fastened with a brooch or something but offer the option of adding fastenings for the extra cost. I am a UK size 18 so I dont know what that translates to in US sizing but I'd be happy with that option. HTH's

[bethac.livejournal.com]

I am busty, and so I buy usually 1X size tops, and everywhere I have shopped (even online places like Roamans, Newport News and Woman Within) have a cost increase usually starting at 2X for the reason you stated. Even with shoes the prices seem to go up some past a certain size. I wouldn't feel bad about it, it does cost more to make so a bit of an increase seems to be par for the course. I am not sure you need to post any explanation when you list the items for sale on why it may cost a little more, since it seems to be standard. And I also would not feel bad about not having plus size stuff up. It's better in my opinion to learn how to do larger size clothing well or not do it at all, since it seems sometimes some places think you should just tack on extra fabric, and not bother with anything else. And it seems from what you say (non-altered spaces and what to do about zippers) that you are one who has looked into it and learned what to do in order to make a great firring item. Not sure if any of that helps or makes sense, but I am happy to answer any question you may have, Good luck, your stuff looks awesome by the way! Elizabeth

[embroiderama]

Yeah, it really does make sense to me. I've looked at clothes on Etsy, and it's an unfortunate reality that handmade plus-size clothes on there are [almost] always more expensive. The only things I've seen that didn't go more expensive for larger sizes were ridiculously expensive to start with.

I do agree with violetknights that if the fasteners are a major cost issue you might offer the option to go without them. I have a nice sweater I love that came with a big pin to close it in front, and I sometimes use that or another pin or just wear it open. Actually, I tend to find jackets or sweaters that zip or button all down the front restrictive-feeling, so I usually wear them open or just attached with one button around the bust area and I suspect I'm not the only larger woman who feels that way. :)

My other recommendation would be to make sure the arms/arm holes are big enough. I've tried on a lot of clothes that are made to fit right around the chest but then squeeze my upper arms like sausages and then I can barely move. With a jacket, I'd err on the side of too generously-sized upper arms rather than too small.

[elmathelas.livejournal.com]

I wear a 2XL and I recognize that there is more fabric in 2XL clothing. In off the rack clothing the amount higher is usually about 10 to 20 percent of the base cost. I think that in general if I saw that something was 50% greater in cost for a handmade item I might appreciate a short note as to why, probably focused not on the extra material or work, which should be obvious, but maybe on the issue of the hooks vs zipper. Then again, I think I'd probably just accept it, for a hand-made item. You can't pay yourself less for the labor, after all, and if there's a small amount of non-altered space in the sweaters then the care will show versus if you'd made a larger size sweater with the same number of pieces. Also the prices on fairy-type sweaters vary pretty widely in price even within shops just based on the labor and materials, and yours seem to be very reasonable to begin with.

In sum-- most people who shop on Etsy are probably crafters themselves and aware that a larger product means more work and more materials. I'd lean towards no note, but if you want to point out the decorative hooks in a "ooh, premium closure!" kind of way that might go pretty far towards explaining why the differential is so much different than one might find at Macy's.

[elmathelas.livejournal.com]

OMG either I have massive arms and shoulders or people who design womens' clothing are morons. I have run into this at Lane Fucking Bryant of all places. And the thing is-- I like my arms! I have legit big muscles in my upper arms and ZOMG I can buy a shirt that fits my bust and belly or even a dress that skims right over my not insubstantial hips with the greatest of ease but still feel like I'm in a damn straight jacket. Or if the sleeves are big enough there's armpit choppage. Even lab coats-- I have to buy a man's coat because while the bust will fit and the circumference will be fine my shoulders are straining.

So, ahem. Seconded.

[embroiderama]

*nods* My upper arms *are* quite large, combo of fat and muscle, but my shoulders aren't particularly broad so I don't understand why jackets are sometimes tight across my back.

[redfirecracker.livejournal.com]

I also wear a 2X, but I have a different sort of problem, in that I am very short. Many commonly available sweaters and jackets are too long on me, and I end up leaving them open anyway. I like the suggestion above of seeing what you can do to minimize fasteners where you can.

Frankly, I think most of us who are plus sized are aware ( and rather resigned ) that we will be paying more for our clothes than our skinnier friends. This is the first that I've heard of the cost of zippers and other fasteners as part of the reason, though, so I do appreciate knowing that! It's a real pain to make properly fitted clothes for plus-sized women, and it's awesome that you're taking the time and trouble to do so. My grandmother STILL knits me sweaters that she just upsizes from a pattern for my slimmer cousins. Fortunately, she lives in Florida, and doesn't know that I just give them away later.

I'm not sure how Etsy works, but maybe you could put an explanation ( similar to then one you gave here ) on your main page, and then include in the item posting a line like, "Please see my seller page for details regarding plus-size cost and sizing options" or something like that?

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

Thanks for the advice. I think I may talk about the additional items in a general sort of way without blatantly saying "this is why it's more," like: Zipper and 3 pretty clasps that look beautiful open or closed, 6 unique sweater colors and textures, etc

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

I'm using this chart to double-check that I've increased all the right areas by the right amounts. http://www.craftyarncouncil.com/files/s-and-g.pdf plus ease to make sure they're comfortably loose.

I think I'm going to talk about the positives of the garments without blatantly saying "this is why it's more", like: Closes with a 22" zipper plus 3 pretty clasps that look beautiful open or closed, made of 6 unique sweater colors and textures, etc

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

I'll keep the armhole thing in mind. I like the idea of optional clasps on some of the sweaters too. I always look for garments with clasps on them at the thrift stores, since I can get 4-5 of them on a shirt for $3 or buy them for $3 each new. I can use what I have, and offer them optional when I run out. :) They're pretty enough that even open they add to the design, i think. http://www.twinrosesdesigns.com/Cloak%20Clasps%20for%20Sale.html


I'm using this chart to double-check the fitting on the off-the-rack sweaters, and wishing I had a local model to try things on. http://www.craftyarncouncil.com/womansize.html

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

I like the idea of mentioning the things that are more and cooler and extra without saying "this is more expensive because:"

I am reassured that "bigger costs more" is sort of a given. I'm going to go with that and not worry about it unless someone has an issue, and then I can talk with them about the specifics.

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

If you want shorter, I can custom sew a sweater-hoodie for you. :) But it's good to know that the price increase is expected.

When I'm using existing zip-up sweaters to make the hoodies from, I've only ever found one that was 2XL. The zippers on the sm-lg sweaters are usually 20-22, and I like a longer sweater that covers the hips, so I usually find a way to add length to that. With the biger sizes, I need a 26-28" zipper (which are impossible to find already on a sweater) or I need to buy them and add the time and cost to the price. A 22" zipper costs $3. A 30" zipper costs $5, so even if I was using new, it would be more expensive by almost double. On the plus-sizes I"m going to add 3 sets of these little metal clasps: http://www.twinrosesdesigns.com/Cloak%20Clasps%20for%20Sale.html or whatever I happen to find on existing thrift-store garments to keep the part above the zipper from being too long.

I don't knit, but I couldn't imagine upsizing a garment that way. I keep an eye on this chart: http://www.craftyarncouncil.com/womansize.html to see how things will fit, but even then people are built different.

I think what I'm going to do is just mention all the things I do to the plus-sizes without saying "and this makes it more expensive." Like I'll mention the extra piecing work and how little "dead" space there is, and how many sweaters went into it, and that there's zipper plus clasps. Especially on the ready-to-wear ones I think that'll do it.

Thanks so much for your info and feedback. I do really appreciate it.

[couchemal.livejournal.com]

I agree with bethac about price. When I was larger I didn't mind paying a little extra. I was just thrilled people acknowledged I existed and made clothes in my slze.

[realpestilence.livejournal.com]

I found it to be a helpful explanation.

[realpestilence.livejournal.com]

Clothes that look nice, aren't polyseter plaid or polka dots, or riddled with pleats, even!

[macbyrne.livejournal.com]

I've always been so grateful to find anything that fucking fits, pardon my french, and is stylish/comfortable/not-a-potato-sack, that the extra cost barely registers. Unless it's bras. Then I'm in a rage, b/c the cost is so much greater from the little A/B cups, and they're for the most part horrible looking, or horribly uncomfortable. But I digress.

Most plus-size customers will be expecting to pay more for a plus-size garment. I had no idea that the zippers/hooks were so problematic/expensive, so you could certainly add a note in regards to that.

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

It's kind of sad how few of the elf-coat things will fit the bigger girls. I definitely want to offer them when I can.

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

I'll put some of the notes in the description, I think, without saying "Here is why it costs more."

[ladyjanelly.livejournal.com]

The materials are such a small part of my costs since I use recycled/thrift store materials, so anything I have to buy new is sort of painful for me. I found a jacket today with $12 worth of hardware on it for $3.50. I'll have to look for more of those.

Thanks for the feedback. I appreciate everyone's thinky thoughts.